PvP in The World

Discussion in 'PvP Discussion' started by Keramory, Dec 19, 2012.

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  1. Keramory

    Keramory Guest

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    11:47 PM
    I figured with kickstarter right around the corner, this topic alone will have plenty of debate and discussion.

    For those who don't know about the PvP in the game, here are a few things to know.

    Free World PvP

    There is free world PvP. What this means is players can come up to other players and kill them on fields and dungeons. However there will be some fields and dungeons which are not PvP enabled. These fields will be less in number compared to PvP fields but we guarentee there will be plenty. Due to the extra danger of PvP enabled fields, PvP fields will yield greater treasures.
    This being said, one can still go through the game competely fine without ever touching the PvP aspect of this game. We do this because we understand there are those players who want nothing to do with PvP and want to service them as well.

    Tournaments

    There will be two types of Tournaments within The World. Offical league / leaderboard Tournaments hosted by the Development team, and Unoffical player run Tournaments.

    Offical League tournaments will be held within Tournament stadiums located in various locations depending on the level range of which Tournaments are held. They are only open to the public and participants during Tournament times.

    Unoffical Tournaments can be held by the players, for the players, anywhere. Staff has created several tournament arenas on various fields in which players can manage their own PvP sport and rules.

    Siege Battles

    Siege Battles will be instanced team battles in where one team invades a fort or castle. Other Siege Battles can include two forts, one for each team, and the objective is to either kill its leader or collect an item and bring it back without dying.
    This is still in concept however, and the details of Siege Battles are still being made. We can however guarentee Siege Battles will be in the game.

    Pending on Funding: Overview PvP
    We wanted to create a fun PvP not depended on levels, equipment, or abilities. For this, we are developing on our spare time an League of Legends style, overview PvP where players can import their characters onto a field with premade abilities dependent on class. The object of this system is still in development.
    Nightcore likes this.
  2. Extian

    Extian Senior Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    I would rather not have siege battles...as they are in almost every mmo it seems...though since I probably won't be joining any teams...I can just pretend like the feature doesn't exist, that should work nicely.
    Seffi and Daikonran like this.
  3. kungfuboom

    kungfuboom Monster Maker! Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    Siege battles should be like the Choice game from Hitman Reborn! :3
    Cryadis likes this.
  4. Daikonran

    Daikonran Well-Known Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    I agree with Extian, I think seige battles are a bad idea. Takes a lot of time and resources to make and generally aren't as entertaining as simple battlegrounds. PvP should be set up like most Popular mmorpgs like WoW, Rift, etc. Where there is battle grounds that are different "games". Like one is you grab the icon in the middle, when someone on your team holds it your team gains points, the person holding it constantly takes damage, first to 1000 win, or another which is capture the flag. Defending the bases in Arathi Basin (or the Codex if you're a Rift Player) is really good as well, and general Arena Brackets.
    What kind of fields? Imo open world PvP (which is what I think you meant by free world, at least it sounds just like it) should mean exactly that. This kinda is a negative for each side of the argument. Those who enjoy open world PvP are going to be disappointed by that in general, and those who do not enjoy PvP are not going to be satisfied with just a few fields especially if the PvP fields have better gear in them. I would suggest two separate servers if you plan on trying to please both crowds of people, one server that is PvP and one server that is PvE, as most mmorpgs these days do, because they really are two different types of play style and don't mesh well together.
  5. Extian

    Extian Senior Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    What he said...
  6. Siegfre
    • Staff / Administrator

    Siegfre [IridiumBased] President Staff Member

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    11:47 PM
    Let me do some clarification.

    At lower levels there will be 4 pve fields for every pvp field possible through keyword combinations. At higher levels it's around 1:1. So if there are 100 keyword combinations at lower levels and 100 keyword combinations at higher levels.
    That's a ton of fields to work with, so their should be no problem for pvp players or pve players finding fields they enjoy playing in. However do note, monster's have murderous intent in pvp fields. No joke.

    The tournament info stands the way it is. But the unofficial tournaments can be setup by guilds, as one of the many event options available to them.

    Also siege battles are dynamic, not an arranged event. Player's/guilds (unlikely that player's will have those kinds of resources but who knows) can "attempt" to build root towns in certain fields using system to create towns. Unlike normal root towns, the various builds and structures in these towns can take damage. Damage from not only players, but enemies as well (if they don't have a barrier setup, or the barrier is broken). These structures are not weak by any means however, and will likely take a concerted effort to destroy. Destroying the structures gives access to the resources inside them whether they are items, money, and more importantly it free's up the territory for another root town to be built there. And sense these areas are not plentiful, there will likely be some squabbling over them by the larger guilds.

    There are more PvP options, I just have to find the information on them first.

    ALSO Please note, neither me or ker is in charge of creating the PvP system. Aryth, and Vayu are working together on the PvP design to make it interesting and unique.

    That said, I'm sure they would love to know what you guys would like to see in the game : P
  7. Daikonran

    Daikonran Well-Known Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    Idk just sounds more complicated than its worth to me. That is just my opinion. I do feel that battleground style PvP (aside from open world PvP) would be easier and have greater appeal. Plus you don't need tons of people to do them or have any friends at all (if set up to allow players to randomly be assigned to a team).
  8. calmchaos

    calmchaos Moderator Staff Member Senior Member

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    1:47 AM
    I actually like the way siege PvP sounds. I generally have a dislike for most kinds of PvP, but I think I may participate in a couple sieges; lots of strategy has to go into them. Events that require time, preparation, and carefully thought out plans are quite appealing to me.

    On the subject of open field PvE, I really wouldn't mind having to fight for my life against just about every thing and every one in certain fields, just as long as I'm not assassinated right before I kill a boss that I had worked hard on, getting his HP low, etc... That would be the only time I'd have a bone to pick with the some one, the boss-thieving-assassin in particular. (Very low chance of this happening, though. From what I've seen of the community, we all have a nice code of ethics.)
    Iasagi likes this.
  9. Aryth

    Aryth Developer Senior Member Indiegogo Backer

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    1:47 AM
    Well, supposing that the game does get a decent player base at some point that is not outside the realm of possibility (being killed right before a boss or something). However, PvP fields force you mitigate a LOT of risk in hopes of getting an awesome reward (for we guarantee nothing).
  10. Cerberuspaw

    Cerberuspaw Senior Member Senior Member Indiegogo Backer

    Local Time:
    1:47 AM
    simple response to being robbed right before a boss remember his name find him and tear him a new one :D odds are he might drop the loot you wanted
  11. Daikonran

    Daikonran Well-Known Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    That's the joys of open world PvP xD Any game that has it I make a list of player names in a notepad who have wronged me. If I see em again, it's on. One of the reasons I loved PvP in TERA. There were safe zones besides town but they were just where you cashed in and got quests, so anywhere else was fair game. But, it should be noted the dungeons were instanced so you didn't have to worry about being PKed cause you only saw people in your party in the dungeon, and you can't attack people in your party.
    Cerberuspaw likes this.
  12. Aryth

    Aryth Developer Senior Member Indiegogo Backer

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    1:47 AM
    Somehow I completely overlooked the Siege discussion. While the Siege idea wasn't mine, I do find it to be a good one. The Battlefield mini-games are likely going to exist (since they're so popular). We aren't abandoning battleground PvP in favor of open world PvP, we're choosing to focus on open world PvP BECAUSE it is more complex. I mean, I don't see why we shouldn't do it now that the idea is out there. It's simpler to leave the game as is (or as it would be), but the same could be said about a multitude of features.
  13. Daikonran

    Daikonran Well-Known Member Senior Member

    Local Time:
    2:47 AM
    I wasn't trying to say no open world and just do battlegrounds. Open World PvP is very different (and just as amazing) than battleground style and I do believe they work amazingly together. I was referring more to Battleground Style PvP over Siege, that siege seems much more complex to implement than battlegrounds and has a lot less appeal. Then on a separate note that Open World PvP should be just that, open world, which would mean all fields that aren't towns is able to PvP instead of:

    The reason for that opinion is that it really doesn't satisfy either crowds of people. That, people who dislike PvP and prefer PvE are not going to be satisfied with this because of the increased difficulty of monsters in PvP fields (which would logically mean better gear, yet monster combat is suppose to be more PvE than PvP) while at the same time the people who enjoy PvP are going to be greatly disappointed as well, just for the sheer fact that people who don't want to PvP atm just won't go to those fields. Part of Open World PvP is that you have to always be aware of your surroundings but if half the fields do not have PvP enabled people that atmosphere will be greatly diminished. This type of system also really diminishes any PKers vs PKKs, which imo is a big part of the atmosphere in dot hack. With zones set up like such, there is no point in PKKs, players will simply tell them to go to a field without PvP. As I mentioned in one of the posts above, they are two type of play styles that really don't mesh well together, PvE and PvP, so imo it would be best to choose to satisfy one crowd instead of disappointing both. Of course, the way major game publishers (both P2P and F2P) get around this is by having PvP Servers and PvE Servers, but I understand the obvious difficulties with doing that.
  14. Keramory

    Keramory Guest

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    11:47 PM
    Worse comes to worse, if the different pvp/nonpvp fields fails....when we open different servers to the game, some will be of PvP and some will not become PvP (all or nothing).

    As for pvp thats not open world, we're looking for ways that require team effort. This includes battle grounds, sieges, and sport like PvP.

    Short story...we dont keep what doesn't work. We try an idea we like...and if it works well great! We're geniuses. If not, we go back from scratch or to where the issue is and simply fix it.
  15. Daikonran

    Daikonran Well-Known Member Senior Member

    Local Time:
    2:47 AM
    I know what you mean Keramory. Was just expressing my opinion on the system. You guys of course will do what you guys think is best.
  16. Aryth

    Aryth Developer Senior Member Indiegogo Backer

    Local Time:
    1:47 AM
    My only trepidation is that a full PvE server isn't .Hack-like, as you referenced many times. So, it's either full PvP all the time or some hybrid system. Of course it requires work. We have, in no way, done any significant work towards PvP, so all of this is likely to change.
    Daikonran likes this.
  17. Keramory

    Keramory Guest

    Local Time:
    11:47 PM
    No worries I appericate criticisms and concerns, especially those as valid as the ones you made. Believe me, I expressed the same concerns when coming up and hearing from other staff about our current PvP system.

    Really in these instances, these kinds of things are up fully to how our players will play the game. We've seen alot of games with great ideas go down the tubes. Prime example...because for some reason they just charged me 40 bucks and I dont know why... is SWTORs PvP system.
    Looked great on paper. Some aspects are kind of similar to ours. Alot of it fell flat on its face. People ended up just camping starting gates and alot of times...acted like jerks. How people play wasn't really thought of, or was not predicted. I dont blame SWTORs developers for that, as its hard to predict such things.

    I love our community and players from many games...however believe me, when we think of a concept...my first thought is how can someone abuse it lol.
    Daikonran likes this.
  18. khilti

    khilti Well-Known Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    well i disappear for a small period of time and everything changes lol. looks good guys and i like the weaker lvs not being pvp. Gives noobs a chance to lv up lol
  19. Vayu

    Vayu Active Member Senior Member

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    2:47 AM
    Siege battles although in every mmo, is still a great and popular game setup. They provide a structured and easy setup for players who want to just jump into the action without having to spend extra time looking for a spot or area where they can engage in pvp. Yes I agree it can be a repetitive and nearly "grinding" format, however, that is why we offer other formats for pvp on top of siege battles. Also Aryth and I are working on making the siege combat less repetitive with multiple features allowing the players to actually control the physical layout of the map, special skill sets given to the players, etc etc etc.
  20. Taltiana

    Taltiana Well-Known Member Senior Member Backer

    Local Time:
    2:47 AM
    Quick question for like official tournaments will we be able to obtain titles. ;)

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